J11 Battery charging system problem

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duncho
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Post by duncho »

No, it's better to use EFB battery to which charging system in J11 was ?designed? for. AGM battery requires slightly higher voltage in order to get fully charged, which will not happen in J11. Purpose of AGM is to accept higher charging current, (when car recuperates kinetic energy into electric energy while breaking) which is then accumulated in the battery. J11 does not support recuperation, therefore your investment will not lead to any benefit at all.
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Montytb4
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Post by Montytb4 »

Hi Duncho,
The stop/start on my QQ has been activating less & less since getting it in June, I don't do many long runs, it tends to be 10mile round trip for work & other shortish journeys over the weekends, though even after a long trip to the Vendee region of France & back to Derby, it still didn't kick in that often.
I took it to the dealer & also reported poor fuel economy & a petrol smell getting into the cockpit - they diagnosed a leak on the fuel rail & it took 3 weeks for the part to arrive. finally I have the car back & even though they said yes the Stop/start is working, it hasn't kicked in once since getting it back, even after a couple of 1/2 hr runs down the motorway.
I've put a meter on the 12v supply & its reading 12.5v with nothing on, when I start the car it rises to 14.60 v, I've not checked it while driving.
Does this sound like a dying battery or does it just need a good charging?

One other thing, a lot of people mention the AC has to be off for the SS to work, yet when I switched it on with the meter attached, it made no difference to the reading, yet turn on the rear screen heater & it drops. This is also fits with what I was finding with the Note I had from the dealer, the SS would work with the AC on but not the rear screen heater.
cheers
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duncho
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Post by duncho »

Hi Montytb4,
AC barely uses any electric power as the only power required for AC to run is for engaging electromagnetic clutch of AC compressor. Heated windshield uses around 700W and rear window defogger about 200W which already is significant power consumption, but covered by alternator. The reason why ppl mentioning AC to be OFF is that drivers comfort has higher priority compare to S/S operation. Leaving AC at AUTO will not disable AC especially not in this weather. If you would be in Cairo with 40'C outside temp S/S will most likely not activate even if AC is on AUTO because ECM would surely activate a fan to cool the engine down.

What Voltmeter are you using is it calibrated? 12.5V with engine OFF is OK, but not enough when car is running, which causes electric current flowing from the battery (discharging). Nissan has implemented Variable Voltage Charging method, which seems not always to work as it should. My experience and measures confirmed that the battery is exceptionally fully charged The most of the time it is charged at about 60-75% of its capacity, which in case you leave your car parked for longer period of time (let's say more than 10days), voltage will slowly be dropping down and battery starts to sulphate which is irreversible chemical reaction and degrades thus the battery life, loosing capacity, increasing inner resistance, etc.. The best you can do is to buy LCD voltmeter, calibrate it and leave it always ON, which will help you to monitor battery charging system. I uses this one with little mod (installed 10K resistor in series with backlight LED in order to cut power consumption to 3mA only): http://www.aliexpress.com/item/DC-7V-20 ... 96446.html

It's hard to say what could be wrong with your S/S system as it is dependent on many factors. If I were you, I would fully charge the battery with a decent battery charger (e.g. MXS-10 http://www.ctek.com/at/en/chargers/MXS%2010) and then try whether it will Stop engine after the engine reach operating temperature. If not, your dealer (if he is capable to do the job) should investigate what causes this to malfunction. Again, my experience showed that what they do is just plugging Nissan Consult to your car and read whether they get any DTCs. If not, their job is most of the time done... Nowadays, there are not many skilled professionals out there. If there are some, they won't bother to work at Nissan, but run their own business instead. Sad but true story..
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Montytb4
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Post by Montytb4 »

Thanks Duncho,
I'm using a Tenma 72-7770 meter
I've only got a fairly old budget charger, 6 or 12v hi or low charge rate.
Yes I thought that would be the case with the dealer - "Is the SS working?" "yes we've tested it & its functioning correctly", well they mean no errors showing on the system.
Would turning the SS to off help recharge the battery?
Another thought has come to me, often when the teenagers are in the car, they ask for the stereo to be left on without the engine running, then the saving power message pops up & shuts it off! I guess that isn't helping the battery.
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duncho
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Post by duncho »

Turning S/S to OFF would help in terms of avoiding repetitive engine restarts and additional electric power consumed by other systems installed in the car (ECM, TCM, BCM, cooling fan speed, radio ON/OFF, lights, foot break, turn lights, etc..). Depends on car model and before mentioned systems status, the car consumes about 10-15A while S/S is active. It however is clever system and as soon as IPDM detects dropping the battery voltage, IPDM sends command to ECM with demand to charge the battery which will cause engine restarting.
Listening the radio does deplete the battery, but not only that. It is enough when you turn engine OFF and you still do something in the car, opening doors, press brake, turn interior lights, anything.. Doing so will delay car going to sleep mode and it also drains the battery (about 5-10A, vary on conditions and car model).
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Alvarez
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Post by Alvarez »

duncho wrote: The best you can do is to buy LCD voltmeter, calibrate it and leave it always ON, which will help you to monitor battery charging system.
You don't have to do this if you have Nissan Connect.
There is a hidden System Diagnose which also shows current voltage.

Press and hold "setup" button and quickly turn right knob a few positions left, few positions right and again few positions left.
Then appears "System Setup Menu". Choose System Status(or similar - I don't remember) and you'll see a battery voltage.
You can easily monitor it during drive.
duncho
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Post by duncho »

Alvarez wrote:
duncho wrote: The best you can do is to buy LCD voltmeter, calibrate it and leave it always ON, which will help you to monitor battery charging system.
You don't have to do this if you have Nissan Connect.
There is a hidden System Diagnose which also shows current voltage.

Press and hold "setup" button and quickly turn right knob a few positions left, few positions right and again few positions left.
Then appears "System Setup Menu". Choose System Status(or similar - I don't remember) and you'll see a battery voltage.
You can easily monitor it during drive.
Yes, there is but its reading is incorrect (it shows voltage higher about 0.48V in my case). Also, it is more than inconvenient to have always "System Running Status" mode displayed as you want to listen a radio, use NAVI or phone to someone. In addition you will not be able to monitor battery voltage status when you come back to the car after several days as you need to unlock your car first and then go to menu, which shows you incorrect readings because hitting car unlock button on your remote will not only unlock your car, but power also BCM with few other car systems by means that power consumption will straight away rise to about 5-8A (60-88W).
Having the LCD voltmeter plugged to power outlet under the dashboard provide you with instant battery voltage readings at almost open battery terminals (without load) if you can forgive your car consuming 20mA of the battery juice at all times...
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brianthelian
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Post by brianthelian »

i have workshop maual j11 this states the alternateor output vis up to 150amps therefore low amp consmables in my opinion should not cause any problems the j11 is desighned for this as for the headlamps mine on 1.6 tekna premium auto have impecable 100% perfect auto dip i hope i dont eat my words in the future ... my manual is on computor there is enormas info. but there is only this huge output alternater for the j11 model.
regards brian
brian
duncho
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Post by duncho »

Brian,
There is no concern of having not enough generated power when car is up and running. The issue is the logic behind IPDM correctly judging the battery charge status.
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montimar
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Post by montimar »

I last reported a battery problem in October and as Nissan refused to pay for a replacement I have overcome the problem by connecting a Smart Charger every week until last week when I forgot. The car has been sat in the Garage for 2 weeks after a 300 Mile run and guess what.
It refused to start and it was another RAC call out to get me running. No problems once started and the RAC reported the Alternator charging voltage to be 14.45 Volts so no problems with that system.
To keep me on the road it's back to a weekly dose of Smart Charging. Anyone got a better Idea.
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